Explicitly clarify that using Development Discussion to circumvent Platform Feedback post restrictions is not allowed and stop dismissing those flags

I agree with @goldencowboy he didn’t do anything bad actually he did something good to tell about us devs *and the admins to discuss how we stop this issuse i think that some *some not all shoutout to @TaipanVII and @Moxyll for actually give warring and sometimes help you

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This happened because you didn’t read the rules nor the category guidelines or check the rest of our categories and their purposes to determine if where you were posting was the correct category or not. This is primarily on you and it comes back to what I, as well as others, have said in the past in that people don’t read information or try to understand our processes first. That being said, this also does speak to the vagueness of the category guidelines.

Admittedly, despite that, I somehow still think including some readable information is still a good solution for some of the problems on the forum, which is what this thread is banking on. It doesn’t typically work but Development Discussion’s category guidelines and post outline (the message that appears in the box that can be deleted) is so vague and ambiguous that a big “NOT FOR SUGGESTIONS OR BUG REPORTS ABOUT ROBLOX” can have enough visibility to deter at least some category misuse.

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@omgcchheeessee

How would a new Member believe that #development-discussion, which has guidelines and rules there to read, be thought as a place to post bug reports despite there being bug reporting categories?

This is once again proving my pointing my point of:

As they have simply not read the rules.


@rogchamp

I agree with this, however, purposefully posting there because you haven’t read the rules is not ok. Far from ok, hence why I suggested the tougher punishment.

This is not “unreasonable”, it is fair punishment for those with ignorance to read.

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I completely agree, this is a serious problem.

Forum members are discovering that they can’t post in website features or bug reports and decide to go in development discussions.

What’s really disturbing is that a lot of these people know the rules, and purposefully post in Development Discussion.

I don’t know about this, but perhaps a solution would be you have to take a quiz on the rules of a category before posting in it? Then there would be stricter punishments, as the only way to post in the wrong category would be to deliberately disobey the rules.

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I still cannot understand why members are allowed to post in discussion. Most of the topics written in that category are ussually created by “New members” and add nothing to the community itself. Buildthomas said that the purpose of this was to “remove the feeling of superiority of Regulars”, but I don’t think such things exists. I’m a member and I HATE seeing those stupid posts and I really would like to be unable to post on that category.

My flags ussualy doesn’t work either, but I don’t receive a message to let me know that the post was already reviewed, DevRel just ignore them.

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Still, a STRIKE for putting something in the wrong category? Also i did read the rules (I was a bit fuzzy on them because it was a lot to remember). However like @rogchamp said everyone makes mistakes. It should at most be a warning for the first time. Extreme punishment like that should be reserved for people who do it over and over that are obviously ignoring the rules.

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It cannot be argued that this issue has started upon the opening of the category to tl1 without some sort of approval of posts before they hit the forum.

Peacefully, I think that the solution to this problem isn’t adding new rules, because nobody reads them, and shoving them in someone’s face would result in a bad ux, but rather the solution would be temporarily closing it down until devrel gets their approval system in place. I asked developer engagement team about it, they said they had a team working hard on it. So I don’t know if it’s a completely automated AI that scans the post and checks if it complies with the rules or whatever lol (but that would be badass) but a system is overdue and it has clearly shown that opening a category that was previously closed causes chaos. I thought we learned from that.


@omgcchheeessee there is literally no reason to not use the correct category. If you read the rules you can’t post in the incorrect category. It is physically impossible. Also:

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I’m not disagreeing with you on the part of if we should punish them I’m disagreeing with you on the how much part. I totally agree there should be something more than a reminder. However I don’t agree that you should get a strike first time. I mean you post something in the wrong category 3 times your banned!!! Strikes should be reserved for people who deliberately try to break the rules over and over.

To clarify I didn’t say anything about how you should get a strike for first-time offenses. I do think it should be beyond feedback for the second time though, preferably a warning (Discourse has warnings built into it), then the third time a strike. Kind of like mini three-strike system which goes 3 strikes and you’re out, but the mini version would be 3 infractions and a strike.

In fact Discourse has a lot of moderation tools, many of them going unused (like warnings and silencing, although for the latter due to how big the forum is, there simply might not be time to silence rule-breakers, so it is easier to just get rid of them), developer engagement team should try them out.

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↓↓↓

He clearly said “purposefully”, and it is also in the rules, it is not “Extreme measures” since people who make those posts ussually just don’t read the rules cuz they dont want to.

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And let posts within the wrong category keep appearing? A simple warning is not enough of a deterrent.

In addition, I’m perplexed you read the rules entirely. There is a whole section dedicated to addressing bug reporting.

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Bug report guidelines

Before @omgcchheeessee say that we can’t currently post in that category

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The part you quoted literally says that if they keep doing it they should get a strike? You still haven’t addressed that. I’m not saying they shouldn’t be punished. I’m saying only obvious repeated rule breakers should get a strike. A strike is a strong punishment. Also i did say that i read the rules!!! I was a bit fuzzy on them. I probably read them over like 3 times in total.

I am disagreeing with repeated offendings here, I want it pushed for singular offences.

My main point is people do not refer to the rules and guidance, I want people to be deterred from ignoring what’s there to be read.

Your mistake could’ve easily not happened if you referred back to the rules you knew existed.

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In my opinion, it’s perfectly reasonable to assume that something as vague as

The Development Discussion category is for any and all topics related to development on Roblox, as well as topics related to Roblox developers.

can encompass nearly anything. The only ways to find out that’s not the case is by:

  • seeing “meta” posts like this one,
  • knowing the old category guidelines,
  • going through threads and seeing what gets locked, or
  • personally getting feedback.

Most people will do either of the latter two, both of which require someone to receive feedback. When learning how to correctly use the category pretty much requires striking people, something is inherently wrong with the systems in place. Striking people for a misunderstanding is needlessly harsh, and the real fix is to both change the category guidelines and let people learn through example. Kicking people out of the forum is not a solution; future users will come in and get chucked out just the same. This will only succeed in alienating new users.

Where is it clear that #development-discussion doesn’t encompass what it says it does (i.e., any and all topics relating to development/developers)?

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Reading the rules; the exact rules which are linked in the PM sent to you when you join the DevForum.

Also for example, there is legitimately a #platform-feedback:engine-bugs category which is pretty hard to miss. If you’ve become a Member, you have most probably scrolled down the home page and seen the category.

Once more, it has “discussion” in its name - why would you discuss a bug report?

Simply, because there is a linked topic in the rules which specifies where to post your bug report:

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What most people fail to understand is that ‘if you can’t post it in the right place, do not post it’. This is a message people frequently miss and they assume that if they post it in the wrong place, it’ll be moved.

It is not the duty of the community or moderators to fix clear mistakes by forum users; if a user is repeatedly disregarding forum etiquette and category rules, they should face a strike as they clearly have no care for using the forum professionally.

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A few months later and this issue is still seriously a concern. I don’t see why normal members of the forum (who aren’t moderators) have to enforce not crap posting in this category.

Members who are extremely new… I can understand. They might not realize that their post isn’t fitting for the forum, and they’ll receive feedback. But instead of giving them feedback every time, can we just strike them for disregarding the guidelines and forum rules? You have to be 13+ to use the forum, which means they should be able to understand the rules and realize it says development discussion.

A new user’s common argument would be that they don’t have any other place to post it. And even some users have the audacity to say on the top of the post “I know this is gonna be taken down but here me out” or “I know this is in the wrong category”. Like what? If you’re aware it doesn’t belong, then don’t post it at all.

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This specific feature request is not relevant anymore. Posts that are off-topic are reliably removed by DET. Flag off-topic posts and forget about them.

Further, I don’t often see any one user make the same mistake twice, the problem is that there are many different users all making the same mistake once. Also, for example, there is a tip in the autofill text for topics in Forum Bugs but people still misuse the category to post platform bugs. There is nothing more to be done to dissuade intentionally using the wrong category other than throwing up a massive modal and threatening users with permanent suspension, and even then it probably still wouldn’t work 100% of the time.

Just flag posts and move on. It’s really not that big of a deal, I don’t see that many off-topic posts, a couple in a day perhaps.

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