Are layered clothing shadows also being worked on? They can sometimes have really huge or offset shadows
4 Likes
new Roblox layered style in itself is a risk
The purpose of the beta is to evaluate the risk. Depending on the results we will decide how we want to move forward, but we will not release this to production unless we have high confidence it wonât break any existing UGC. This is why weâre asking for your help, there are too many combinations for us to test it exhaustively by ourselves.
6 Likes
LC shadows are a known issue that we do plan to fix, but I donât know the timeline.
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This change negatively affects some of my outfits, but my situation is probably WAY more specific than anyone else here.
I like experimenting with layered clothing (LC), and a lot of my outfits involve complicated LC combinations with modified LC properties, all of which cannot be accomplished normally through Robloxâs avatar editor, and instead must rely on calling avatar APIs directly.
Itâs possible to use AvatarEditorService for some of this, so I made an entire place to easily edit LC, mainly for my own personal use. The main point here is that you can lower the Puffiness property of your clothes to actually make LC look good on classic avatars, since LC often appears way too inflated on them.
(Puffiness is a number from -1 to 1 (defaults to 1) that controls how compressed LC is. The documentation says 0 to 1. The documentation is incorrect.)
Before/after lowering Puffiness from 1 to -1. The difference can be staggering!
(The beta was not enabled here. This is just to show off the power of negative Puffiness values.)
However, some clothes with lowered Puffiness values just look worse after this update. They ironically appear more inflated in some cases.
Before/after enabling the beta feature. Take a look at the blocky astronaut, especially around the feet/hips. Itâs suddenly built like an hourglass, with much thicker arms.
Also, the astronaut is only wearing one LC item, which is the space suit itself. If this change only affects multi-layered outfits, then why is the astronaut being affected?
Clearly, it appears that single-layered outfits are also affected, but only if they have negative Puffiness. (This would also explain why the 2nd avatarâs pants arenât affected, but the sweater is.)
Another example. This is my main avatar that I usually always use for everything. Like I said before, I like experimenting a lot with LC, and this avatar configuration is a great example of that:
(The beta was not enabled here.)
This avatar has a jacket, and an underlying shirt which you canât see.
The jacket has a Puffiness of -0.5. The shirt has a Puffiness of 1.
It also has pants with Puffiness 0 and âshoesâ (uploaded as a shirt) with Puffiness -0.6.
Normally, the cuffs on the arms that Iâm using create somewhat of a ridge on the jacket. I like using these arms with LC, but the ridges look kinda weird, and the shoulders are a bit too sharp.
I found out that if I wear this shirt under the jacket, and lower the jacketâs Puffiness so that itâs not over-inflated, the shirt will hide those ridges and make my shoulders less sharp. Much better! My hair also doesnât clip through the jacket as significantly anymore.
But once I enable the beta, the shirt no longer has any significant effect on my arms. The ridges are back, and my shoulders are sharp once again.
I might as well mention my shoes. My shoes are okay in the beta. Everything gets kinda squished at the point where my pants meet, but itâs not very noticeable. I canât tell if this is an improvement or not.
Here is a model containing all 3 avatars showcased here, complete with HumanoidDescriptions:
characters.rbxm (224.4 KB)
If the whole point of Puffiness is to compress your clothes, then what does this new LC update accomplish that Puffiness doesnât, other than being completely automatic? And if the API supports Puffiness, why was it never used for anything?
This change just seems to be ruining some of my outfits that rely on Puffiness. Some of them are OK in the beta, some arenât. But I also understand that Iâm probably one of the only people who experiments this much with LC, so I doubt Roblox would be willing to give up this update just because of my complicated outfits which can literally only be equipped through direct API callsâŚ
Maybe just donât apply the new changes on clothes with Puffiness values less than 1? I donât know. I just donât want this change to potentially ruin my outfits.
15 Likes
Thanks for the excellent report, this is exactly what we were looking for with this beta. Our testing canât cover all the cases that exist on the platform so this is a great help.
This is surprising and unexpected, we will take a look and see whatâs going on.
This update isnât meant to replace puffiness, you should be able to use them together.
Without getting into too many details, the puffiness control is used. Even when set to 0 it is applying a correction, and it can be adjusted as you have done.
The APIs you are using are a valid part of the LC system, and they should work as expected. If they are not behaving well we will not release the beta to production as it is. This will require some more investigation to understand whatâs happening, we will reach out to you if we have any questions.
We are aware that any changes do the LC wrapping could have negative impacts on some outfits, but we werenât sure how severe those effects might be or not. This is why weâre making this beta available, so we can get feedback from the community and decide how to proceed based on that.
5 Likes
Thanks for the clarifications, but Iâm a bit confused on what you mean by this:
As far as Iâm aware, Puffiness is never applied on platform avatars automatically. The only way to use Puffiness is to directly set it through APIs.
Even if you already have custom Puffiness specified on your clothes, making any change to your currently-worn items in Robloxâs avatar editor will automatically clear the Puffiness params specified on all of your clothes. Additionally, any outfits you create with Puffiness params saved to clothes will not have the Puffiness applied when you attempt to wear the outfit via the avatar editor. (this can all be quite annoying)
Also, the default value is 1, not 0. Clothing will always be fully inflated unless you directly set the Puffiness values to something else.
EDIT: Equipping an outfit from the web avatar editor now correctly applies puffiness/order.
5 Likes
Youâre right, my mistake. Weâre still evaluating the use of puffiness and itâs interaction with this beta. Thanks again for all the details!
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Another issue with the beta. Apparently this update completely breaks some avatars that rely on the â(Mini) Plushie Avatarâ series of layered clothing items.
Before/after enabling the beta feature. Enabling the beta heavily distorts all the clothes.
(None of these avatars rely on Puffiness. This is a completely different issue than what I previously talked about.)
Removing the â(Mini) Plushie Avatarâ item from all of the avatars and then toggling the beta feature has very little noticeable difference, so it clearly has something to do with that specific item.
Before/after enabling the beta feature, with the â(Mini) Plushie Avatarâ item removed from all 5 avatars.
Here is a model containing all 5 avatars showcased here, complete with HumanoidDescriptions:
plushcharacters.rbxm (214.8 KB)
(Iâm posting this for @RealTitoepf, who notified me of this issue and currently isnât able to post on the DevForum themselves.)
11 Likes
I primarily use layered clothing on Rthro avatars to achieve a ârealisticâ look. This is somewhat of an improvement but with some drawbacks. Most layered clothing is either clipped or distorted due to using more than one layer of clothing. This affects almost every type of clothing in the marketplace. To illustrate the distortion, I used a Rthro body package and duplicated a pair of pants, then compared them before and after the fix (Theoretically, this can be replicated with any Rthro package and pants from the marketplace).
Pants Comparison
Before
This seems puffier with less distortion while it evenly distributes.
After
This seems more accurate but with more distortion and uneven distribution (deformation).
Moreover, adding clothes on top of a single layer of clothing (such as a bodysuit) causes clipping. To further investigate, I observed that some clothes have more chances of clipping due to the mesh being âtoo thin.â I assume this could be a caging problem on the UGC creatorsâ part or if the fitting algorithm does not wrap around the avatar accurately.
Here's an example
Before:
After:
I used this body package for the upper body and replaced the legs with another body package with the head and hair.
These are the clothes ordered in sequence:
In conclusion, the new fitting algorithm worsened the visual appearance of my avatars from this change.
11 Likes
I was wondering if it would ever be possible to implement a layerd clothing puffiness slider in the actual avatar editor?
Because a lot of my outfits seem to break/glitch because it becomes too puffy.
Or I view the layered clothing in an avatar creator game first before purchasing it, and it looks how I want it to be, but when I wear it in other games with player decided avatars enabled my clothes are suddenly much puffier than what it was when I tested it out in the avatar creator game and it makes me feel like I sort of wasted my robux.
6 Likes
This is awesome especially for those who are interested in clothing making.
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Hi, is this going to be coming to the website/app? Currently itâs possible to make a very cute avatar in any of a number of catalog experiences which then unfortunately look very bloated and weird on the site/in other games. The beta looks much, much better than what users have access to, currently.
2 Likes
Does this affect Robloxâs avatar editor? My old avatar with layered clothing that worked fine before is now ruined. Arms kinda disort and squeeze, it looks unnatural and just weird.
1 Like
When is this coming to the client? My game has clothing customization where you can stack coats on top of vests which looks great in Studio (albeit with a bit of clipping), but ingame the sleeves are overblown into looking like trumpets and the clothes are overall far puffier than they should be.
Beta:
Ingame:
Itâs fairly minor, but something like this coming ingame would massively help some developers. If this causes problems, it would be good to have the ability to toggle between the old fitting and this new fitting.
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